While it may have been ahead of its time, one documentarian explores how a Kevin Smith classic is a bit divisive while still changing his life in Chasing Chasing Amy. The movie centers on filmmaker Sav Rodgers as he seeks to explore Chasing Amy's impact on the LGBTQ+ community, only for what he learns in his journey to put him on a new path of self-discovery.
In addition to starring Rodgers and his now-wife Riley Rodgers, Chasing Chasing Amy features interviews from a wide array of subjects, including Smith himself, as well as Chasing Amy stars Jason Lee and Joey Lauren Adams, the latter of whom put the movie on a whole new path. Seamlessly transitioning between its two subjects, the documentary is hilarious, emotional, and a thoroughly insightful look into Smith's positive and negative impacts on the LGBTQ+ community.
In honor of the movie's Tribeca Film Festival premiere, Screen Rant exclusively caught up with director/star Sav Rodgers and associate producer/star Riley Rodgers to discuss Chasing Chasing Amy, the emotional journey of the documentary's evolution, crafting a balanced discussion for the Smith classic's legacy, and more.
Sav & Riley Rodgers Discuss Chasing Chasing Amy
Screen Rant: In the documentary, you explore a little bit about how it transformed after a certain point in your original process. But what was it like for you, in that moment, figuring out how to pivot the documentary away from exploring Chasing Amy's legacy to how it impacted you personally?
Sav Rodgers: Yeah, there were a lot of great conversations had with the other producers on this project. Our editor, Sharika Ajaikumar, our A.D. Lauren Devlin, even one of our DPs, Bradley Garrison. There are so many great collaborators on this thing that when you hear a note enough times, you feel compelled to listen. You hear it once, it's like, "Alright, I'll consider it," you hear it twice, it's like, "Alright, well, this could be a pattern here."
When you hear it 20-50 times over the course of a project, you should really listen, because people are trying to tell you the truth. I think that's the greatest gift that that somebody can give you is the truth, and I'm very thankful that we had such a good team on this that was willing to be honest with me. Because I had set out to make a pretty straight documentary that was about the intersection of the LGBTQ community and Chasing Amy, and what good representation looks like versus bad representation, and it became increasingly more personal over time.
While I dug in my heels and didn't want to as a person, I also recognized as a storyteller that, yeah, this probably is the best version of the story. Now, how do we do it the right way, and that's what we tried to accomplish here.
Well, I think it was handled very well. Riley, I'll come to you next, what was it like when Sav here approached you with the idea of being on-camera and being a very pivotal part of this documentary, as much as being a part of his life?
Riley Rodgers: It's very interesting, because people think it was like he approached me with some kind of proposal or a release, like, "Okay, here's the thing, just sign it." It was a very gradual thing, because I have been stuck to him since way before the documentary started being such a solid thing, a thing that was so mapped out. So, I was just there and the content that is in the documentary is just very organic, since we were long-distance
It's the stuff that we had, the material that just came to life in our day-to-day life. So it was just like, "Okay, so there's been a little bit of a change of plans." And it wasn't even like that, because I was sitting basically next to him while all this was happening, and I could just kind of tell that he was being more and more immersed in the documentary as a subject more than just the director or the mastermind behind it.
It was just like, "Okay, he's gonna be in it, so that means I'm gonna be in it. I am his, at that moment, his fiance, girlfriend, whatever, I'm probably gonna be in it," and he was just like, "Well, yes, you're gonna be featured more." Since it was his story, it was a no-brainer for me, it was just making it a little bit more official, being like, "Okay, so all of these things that were already happening, we're just gonna put them in the edit, and make it a little bit more of a big deal, because the documentary is now more about your relationship." So, for me, it just becomes having the best memento of our relationship, really.
Sav, Riley said it was a gradual process, but were you nervous at all to really talk with her about having her be as big of a part of it as you?
Sav Rodgers: For sure. I didn't want to be in it, let alone wrap somebody I love up in that. I think I'm pretty good at a work-life balance, generally speaking, I like to work with somebody who understands how much I like to work. But, I say it in the movie, our relationship is private, so it was kind of weird to — and eye I this — have a camera in her face. I could have said no at any time, but I was trying to surrender to what the story became, while also navigating how uncomfortable I was on camera, let alone introducing somebody I love into it. As much as it wasn't a big deal for you, it was very important that that trust was there, like, "Look, you're not going to have all of our personal information released, or anything like that, it's just about our love story a little bit there," so I'm so thankful that she was in it.
Well, I can't think of a better way to tie in your love story than with Chasing Amy, a movie that's meant so much to you and other people. I love the way that you present it as both a positive and a negative representation of the LGBTQ+ community, because it really can be argued for both. You have such a great range of academics and people directly involved with the movie, how did you go about putting together the list of people to talk to outside of the film?
Sav Rodgers: It was important to me and the other producers on this that there was a pretty balanced representation of who was commenting on Chasing Amy as a film, and how it exists in the broader culture. Because that's really where the story started from was how does this movie exist in our culture, and what does that mean? So, having an academic perspective, having cultural writers and commentators in there, film festival programmers, people who work in entertainment, queer people.
That was all super important, just in of representing the diversity of perspectives, and also showing that not any one community is a monolith, right? Because you put 50 people in a room to talk about Chasing Amy, you come out with 200 different opinions. It's a very nuanced thing where multiple things are true at once, so it was exciting to see how all the talking heads came together in that way, because they provide such incisive commentary.
And it kind of leaves it up to the audience to decide where they fall, how they personally feel, but also showing that it doesn't matter how you ended, it doesn't matter what I think about Chasing Amy. This is just how Chasing Amy exists in the world, and appears to all these different, really intelligent people.
Was there any one person that you spoke to, outside of Joey Lauren Adams, who you found really gave you a unique new perspective on the film that you hadn't really thought of before?
Sav Rodgers: Hmm. Sarah Jen's interview was fantastic. She's an academic, she's a PhD of bisexualities studies, and for her to be able to really hit the nail on the head of the specific depictions of bisexuality throughout time was just amazing. I was sitting there and I was like, "Oh, my god, how am I going to fit this all into the movie, there could be a whole movie just about this." So, I really respected her interview, and I just loved getting to work with her that day. I was very excited about hers.
You have all the footage of you two together, and you have all the footage from all of your interviews. How do you go about in the editing process really deciding which pieces to keep and which pieces to cut? Where was the line drawn on certain aspects of the movie's conversations?
Sav Rodgers: Great question. My main priority was trying to figure out what is the movie, right? There's so much in of rich material to pull from that we got from all of our interview subjects and participants, not just the ones who made it into the final cut. It's recorded stories of queer history, their discussions about Chasing Amy, obviously, but also the new queer cinema movement, what it was like to be queer at certain points in time, from individual perspectives.
So, we had to figure out, "Well, what is the movie," and the movie ended up being — and this was my call — was every scene has to be about my evolving relationship to Chasing Amy, or else it doesn't fit. So, we ended up leaving a lot of things on the cutting room floor that we thought were cute or funny or interesting, but it just didn't feel like it fit into this movie. To be able to narrow the focus that way, it just allowed us to be able to have a 92-minute movie, which I was very thankful for, because it would be very easy, I think, for a movie like this to drag that has so many different story elements, all happening at the same time, in parallel, concurrently.
It was a tough process to get to that point, just because I was overwhelmed with the amount of rich material we had. But, hopefully, I'll figure out something to do in the future with that, many, many years after this is done. [Laughs]
That's such a long process of getting all these interviews and everything. How do you feel when you finally see the finished product, and you get to see people's reactions to it after that long of a production cycle?
Sav Rodgers: Well, I've seen about 80 versions of the finished version of the movie at this point. [Laughs] So, by the time that, last night, I got to sit with an audience, it's like, "Okay, the movie's out there, people are laughing at the right times, people seem to be crying at the right times, and people are so kind and so genuine, they're engaging with it already, even after just 16 hours, or whatever, since it premiered."
I'm really just excited to be able to sit down with an audience again and see how they react, because I think, in the same way that I think you'll go into Chasing Amy and get something out of it that you might be looking for unconsciously, or it'll confirm something that you think, I think the same thing can be said for Chasing Chasing Amy.
How do you go about fostering that same trust with a lot of your interview subjects, especially ones who you don't get to talk with multiple times like you did with Kevin Smith and Joey?
Sav Rodgers: I think the TED Talk imbued a lot of trust in the participants. When you put yourself out there, and you're vulnerable in that way, I think it does sometimes earn a degree of trust that might not otherwise be there. But, I just tried to treat people kindly, and I tried tosay that, "Look, you don't have to do this. I'm totally respectful of your time, if this works for you, great. If this doesn't, I hope you have a nice day."
And a surprising number of people said "Yes" to being interviewed as a result of that. But, also, people did us favors, they introduced us to people, they said, "Hey, you want to interview this person for your documentary, they'd be a great fit." So, there's also a degree of people being kind to our team, and people on the team being kind to me by offering, and trying to leverage some of their connections, or friends of friends, to be able to talk to these folks.
That's amazing, I love when I hear people paying it forward for up-and-coming filmmakers like yourself.
Sav Rodgers: You know what, I have a lot to pay forward as a result of this movie, because people have been incredibly generous in of their time, and their kindness. Because, again, nobody had to say yes to this, this was a fairly specific idea for a movie that people humored me on, or saw the potential of, and I couldn't be more thankful.
Riley, we've heard Sav's feelings about finally getting to show the movie to people and hearing their reactions, what it was like for you when you finally got to see the end product and to see how people were responding to it?
Riley Rodgers: Well, I watched it first before it premiered a few weeks or months ago, I don't exactly recall. But, I had heard wonderful things about it already from collaborators and stuff, and I was very excited to see it. Also very nervous in my anticipation, because like you said, it has been a project that had been in the works for so long, and in a way, I didn't even really know what to expect, because I had been floating around the process for so long.
I had an idea in my head of what it was, and when I watched it, it was just something completely and absolutely different, like, the story just branched out in so many directions. I was also mind blown, because I could hear his voice so clearly in in the movie that I was like, as a best friend, as a person, as his partner, just to see this come to fruition and full circle was just the best feeling in the world. I didn't have words. To see his voice and all his hard work completely realized in front of me, what can I say?
Like he says, it's a love letter to me, and whatever that is, just no words. But there was also a part of me that was like, "This is amazing, even with all my bias aside, because, it's cultural impact, the LGBT themes about it, this is amazing, I love it." I genuinely wanted to watch it for what it is.
Sav Rodgers: Well, and to give her more credit than she'll ever take, she helped me every step of the way. Even if she didn't know what the final edit would be, in addition to being emotional , like, there were ideas about a stop-motion sequence, she was helping me build miniature sets and test stuff out. Art Department, helping me wrangle things when needed, making runs when I would need it. Every step of the way, Riley has been an invaluable part of this team, and this process, and I'm just thankful for the space and the trust to finish the movie, and then show her, versus, "Hey, let me investigate. How do I look in this scene?" The way that I know I would be, I'd be tyrannical. [Laughs]
The Joey interview was quite a big deal in the film. Looking back on it now, I'm curious, how far back was that moment in this production, and how are you feeling about it now, in comparison to that moment?
Sav Rodgers: Yeah, we shot that interview in October 2019, I don't the exact date off the top of my head, but it was a real game changer. In the moment, obviously it feels vulnerable and challenging, but when somebody trusts you with their story that much to be able to tell you the truth, even if it might not be the popular thing to say in that moment, maybe it's vulnerable for you to say something like that.
I'm grateful to Joey for the opportunity to hear her story, and to be able to then share her story in the context of this documentary, it's incredibly meaningful. She's somebody whose work I ire deeply, and I'm excited to see all that's coming for her, as both an actor and a director. And the moment now, I'm happy with how the film turned out, I'm really grateful for for Joey's gift of there.
It unquestionably shaped the way that my life moved forward, in addition to the movie, and what I always say is, this is Joey's real life, this is my real life, this is Riley's real life, Kevin's, Guinevere's. So, I wanted to take that responsibility really seriously, this isn't just a fiction film, there's a real responsibility to everybody involved. So, we just tried to do it as best we could.
For my final question, before I let you both go, now that you have this film under your belt, what can we expect from you in the future?
Sav Rodgers: I think you can expect a lot more sass from her. [Chuckles] No, in of next stuff, I'm sure that Riley will keep working on movies with me, and I'm so thankful for that, because she's the best collaborator, she's the most fun part of my day every day.
Riley Rodgers: I'm gonna keep him humble. [Chuckles]
Sav Rodgers: [Laughs] She knows she's the star. For me, I just want to keep telling the stories that are joyful, optimistic, and way more than the worst things that have ever happened to us. I think that we're a lot better in community with each other than we are isolated, and I think that's kind of a common theme of the stories that I'm really interested in telling. So, regardless of if that's narrative or documentary, I'm just stoked for whatever happens next, and I know whatever happens next, I got the best partner in the world right next to me.
About Chasing Chasing Amy
In ‘Chasing Chasing Amy,’ filmmaker Sav Rodgers takes a journey of self-discovery while making a documentary about Kevin Smith’s ‘Chasing Amy’' and its polarizing reputation among LGBTQ+ people.
The feature documentary explores the transformational impact of the ‘90s rom-com on a 12-year-old queer kid from Kansas, coming of age and to with his identity. For young Sav Rodgers, the Kevin Smith cult classic became a life raft. As Rodgers examines the film and its making as a cornerstone of LGBTQ+ cinema, he finds himself at a complicated crossroads.
Chasing Chasing Amy premiered June 8 at Tribeca Film Festival and is expected to have a wide release later this year.
